Breaking Down Evanston’s Proposed Disposable Shopping Bag Ban
A guide to the issues surrounding disposable bag bans and taxes.
Evanston’s proposed ban on all paper and plastic disposable shopping bags may be divisive, but it is far from original. During the past several years, a handful of communities have passed legislation taxing or prohibiting the use of such bags, and in these places, similar debates arose over potential economic repercussions, the legitimacy of environmental concerns and the feasibility of altering people’s long-held habits. In success or failure, these precedents have provided Evanston with models to examine and plenty of information as ammo for whatever dispute is on the horizon.
An Overview of Precedents
Washington D.C.:
On Jan. 1, 2010, a D.C. law went into effect that banned the use of disposable, non-recyclable plastic bags and imposed a 5-cent per bag tax on the use of recyclable paper and plastic shopping bags. One year later, the city has seen a 78 percent decrease in the use of such bags, and has collected near $2 million in related tax revenue, all of which has gone towards cleaning the Anacostia River.
Seattle:
The Seattle City Council passed a law in July 2008 that would have levied a 20-cent per bag tax on all disposable shopping bags and even announced plans to provide all households with at least one reusable shopping bag to ease the transition. But opponents gathered enough signatures to turn the ban into a referendum, which was ultimately voted down during the next eligible city election. In the months leading up to the vote, plastic bag makers launched a significant campaign against the proposal, reportedly outspending ban proponents by a measure of 15-to-1.
California:
In September 2010, California lawmakers voted against a statewide ban on single-use plastic shopping bags, many ascribing their opposition to the potential financial burdens they thought the ban might place on consumers and retailers. Under the proposed law, customers would have still been allowed to purchase recyclable paper bags at grocery stores for 4 to 6 cents. Before the vote, the American Chemistry Council, a plastics trade association and government lobbyist group vehemently opposed to any ban on plastics, created an ad campaign entitled “Stop the Bag Police.” The group took out TV and radio spots, and launched a website, all pushing the viewpoint that “lawmakers should be working on [California’s] real problems” by addressing the state’s budget deficit and high unemployment rates. Still, California cities like San Francisco, Palo Alto, Fairfax and Malibu have all passed disposable shopping bag bans.
China:
In January 2008, China banned shops from giving out free plastic shopping bags in an effort to reduce pollution, encouraging consumers to use baskets or cloth sacks instead. The move saved China an estimated 40 billion plastic bags the following year, according to the China Chain Store and Franchise Association, an amount equivalent to 1.6 million metric tons of oil.
Financial Impact:
Consumers have demonstrated that they are willing to adjust their habits in the face of a ban or tax on single-use shopping bags, often switching to carrying store-bought goods in some form of reusable tote. But some worry that such alterations could also spell bad news for local businesses.
A Jan. 2011 study released by The Beacon Hill Institute at Suffolk University, a Boston-based research center specializing in public economics and tax analysis, evaluated the economic impact of Washington, D.C.’s 5-cent bag tax and concluded that the local economy would take a small hit from the levy.
The study, which was commissioned by Americans for Tax Reform, a D.C.-based nonprofit special interest group opposing all tax increases, found that “all other things being equal, consumers will allocate a portion of their spending to the Bag Tax or divert spending outside D.C. to avoid the tax” and that “both will reduce consumption spending in D.C.”
In total, researchers estimated that the tax would eliminate 101 local jobs, cause annual wages to fall by $18 per worker and lower aggregate real disposable income by $5.64 million.
Paul Dachman, director of research at the Beacon Hill Institute, said the numbers “weren’t eye-popping” in terms of the total D.C. economy, adding “you could say it’s a drop in the bucket, unless it’s one of your jobs [being cut].”
Dachman said that an outright ban of single-use bags would yield different results, since it would not take money directly from the private sector, but also said he could envision such a restriction still having some negative effect on businesses operating near city limits.
However, in a recent report generated by the City of Evanston’s office of sustainability, city officials argued that a ban might save Evanston residents an average of $17.14 annually by eliminating hidden disposable bag costs that retailers pass on to consumers. They also suggested residents could use these savings to purchase reusable shopping bags.
Todd Ruppenthal, owner of Happy Husky Bakery and president of the Central Street Business Association, said he could foresee customers buying fewer items if they were unable to fit all their desired purchases in their reusable sack.
But a Feb. 2011 survey commissioned by the Alice Ferguson Foundation, a Maryland-based nonprofit environmental advocacy organization, found that 58 percent of D.C. business owners said they had seen no changes to their business, with 20 percent responding that the tax had a positive effect. An additional 12 percent said the tax had affected their business negatively.
Paper vs. Plastic:
One of the big debates that has occurred within other communities that have elected to ban or tax disposable shopping bags is: which is more eco-friendly (or less harmful), paper or plastic bags?
The answer is not simple, partially because much of the readily available information on the subject comes from the American Chemistry Council, a plastics trade association and government lobbyist group vehemently opposed to any ban on plastics. However, it seems generally agreed that paper bags are more harmful to the environment before they hit consumer’s hands, while plastic bags are more damaging after they are used.
Paper bags are made from wood pulp, which comes from lumber, while plastic bags are made from polyethylene, a polymer extracted in refining crude oil.
Paper bags require more energy during manufacturing and transport (40 to 300 percent more, depending on the source of information), partially because they weigh more than plastic ones, and hence require more fuel to move. According to several sources, manufacturing a paper bag also creates significantly more air pollutants (near 70 percent more) and water pollution (near 50 times more) than making a plastic equivalent.
However, according to a 2009 Illinois Commodity/Waste Generation Study, Illinois residents recycle 37.8 percent of paper shopping bags and uncoated cardboard (grouped together in the report) as opposed to only 1.5 percent of plastic shopping bags. In fact, paper shopping bags often contain 40 to 60 percent post-consumer content, while plastic bags made from recycled materials are much rarer.
Though paper bag recycling is more common, it comes at a cost. Recycling a paper bag requires roughly 85 times more energy than the process for recycling a plastic one, according to Evanston’s recent office of sustainability report.
Plastic bags, on the other hand, tend to end up in landfills and sometimes in water sources. A 2006 Greenpeace report entitled “Plastic Debris in the World’s Oceans” found that 267 marine species are known to have suffered from entanglement or ingestion of plastic debris.
Reusable Shopping Bags:
The City of Evanston is advocating for the increased use of reusable shopping bags as a way to eliminate the need for retailers to hand out disposable bags. Evanston officials have even suggested that the City might “provide bags to income qualified households or…partner with businesses to offset the cost of the bags through advertisement.”
Several of Evanston’s larger chain stores already offer reusable bags, made available for purchase at checkout. Dominick’s sells two sizes of such totes ($2 and $3) and Whole Foods offers several options, from a 99-cent bag with a lifetime wear-and-tear warranty to a large $10 insulated version.
In addition to popular canvas bags and reusable satchels made from 100 percent recyclable material, more recently several companies have taken to making small compactable bags, many weighing less than two ounces, capable of holding near 25 pounds and potentially small enough to fit in a purse or pocket, intended to make it reasonable to carry one at all times.
But recent studies have pointed to some reusable bag drawbacks.
A June 2010 University of Arizona study found that the reuse of grocery bags present an opportunity for cross contamination of foods and, if unwashed, can play host to bacteria growth. Of 84 reusable bags randomly collected from shoppers in Tucson, Los Angeles and the San Francisco Bay Area, researchers found harmful bacteria in nearly half and E. coli bacteria in 12 percent.
While most reusable totes are machine washable, 97 percent of people surveyed during the study admitted to never cleaning their bags.
Another study, released in Nov. 2010 by independent contract laboratory TEI Analytical, Inc., found near half of reusable shopping bags made with Non-Woven Poly Propylene contain unsafe levels of lead, raising both environmental and health concerns.
The results sent reusable bag manufacturers scrambling to test their own bags, with several companies posting guarantees soon after assuring customers that their bags were not part of the study and had passed independent tests for harmful chemicals.
John Miller
6:15 am on Tuesday, May 31, 2011
Can you see a family of four doing their weekly shopping with reusable bags? Ludicrous!
Jim Caldwell
7:22 am on Tuesday, May 31, 2011
I can see a family of four do their weekly shopping with reusable bags, John.
My family has been doing it for a few years now.
Ludicrous? Hardly.
Richard Schulte
6:56 am on Tuesday, May 31, 2011
"But recent studies have pointed to some reusable bag drawbacks.
A June 2010 University of Arizona study found that the reuse of grocery bags present an opportunity for cross contamination of foods and, if unwashed, can play host to bacteria growth. Of 84 reusable bags randomly collected from shoppers in Tucson, Los Angeles and the San Francisco Bay Area, researchers found harmful bacteria in nearly half and E. coli bacteria in 12 percent.
While most reusable totes are machine washable, 97 percent of people surveyed during the study admitted to never cleaning their bags."
Just another example of the law of unintended consequences.
Marilyn Gardner
7:36 am on Tuesday, May 31, 2011
Why provide bags to "income qualified" people while letting a struggling-against-property-taxes middle class pay for it? Just the administration of such a program would add to our tax burden, not counting the cost of the bags.
J C
8:35 am on Tuesday, May 31, 2011
Well a reusable bag could be a plastic trash bag, After all you will be re useing it..Or will they be baning them also, And what of the paper yard waste bags? May as well ban them too, And force us to compost ..
Also paper and plastic cups.....Bye Bye Starbucks....And what about McDonalds...Talk about over packaging...The'll have to go...Paper coffiee filters..Forget it....Oh is there an Eco freindly Cat box bag,
Kitonius Maximus(aka Bob) want's to know?
Jim
9:26 am on Tuesday, May 31, 2011
I guess we will have to leave the dog poop on the ground.
Paul Pint
9:39 am on Tuesday, May 31, 2011
The customers should not be punished for using unreusable bags, but rather rewarded for using reusable bags.
Chris Ernst
9:39 am on Tuesday, May 31, 2011
While I agree that consumers should reduce their use of plastic bags, legislation banning their use is not the best use of our time or resources. As a point of information, most plastic bags CAN be recycled (yes, right here in the US).
For a different view of the debate, readers might find this article interesting:
http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/green-living/plastic-fantastic-carrier-bags-not-ecovillains-after-all-2220129.html
Richard Schulte
9:55 am on Tuesday, May 31, 2011
Good article. . . .
"All bags have an impact. The best solution would be to use a cotton bag several hundred times, probably using it constantly for years. If you are not going to do that, a plastic bag – re-used as a bin liner – is the next best option, better than paper. Avoid accepting a plastic bag unless you need one, though."
Alexis Eyler
10:37 am on Tuesday, May 31, 2011
As both an Evanston resident and business owner, I think the issue is very complicated. I personally use reusable bags for grocery shopping, but I can't ask my customers to provide a reusable bag when they are purchasing gifts (a large part of our business). We are introducing a program this summer to start giving a reusable bag to our best customers, offering a discount when they use their bag; and we will also offer the bag for purchase for other customers who would like to be a part of the program, but, again, this really doesn't apply to gift purchases. While I think that the $$ impact may not be significant overall, many small businesses are already struggling and the proposed ban/tax will make it that much more difficult to recover. If the city wants to ban plastic/paper bags at grocery stores and big box retailers, be my guest, but, please consider strongly how it impacts small businesses. Does Evanston really need more empty retail space? I can't speak for other businesses, but we don't pass on the costs of packaging to our customers. Further, we are a small local business that gives a lot back to the community. And we take our environmental impact seriously. We have switched from plastic bags to recycled paper bags and boxes, at an increased cost to us, but our prices have not increased. I hope that this issue is carefully examined from all angles and a decision is made that supports both the environment and Evanston's small businesses.
Lori Jackson
11:33 am on Tuesday, May 31, 2011
I visited Coucou this past weekend where I was given a reusable canvas bag designed by the store. If I use it for my purchases, I will receive a 10% discount. I will not only use it, but will try to shop for more of my clothing purchases with the store (vs at Old Orchard or on Michigan Ave). I also love using my reusable bags at Whole Foods and donating the credit. Maybe more local businesses can try similar "rewards" for using reusable bags and increase their business. I, for one, would be happy to pay a tax for a paper or plastic bag if I need one. It would be good for the city's budget and for the environment.
spider16
11:55 am on Tuesday, May 31, 2011
They say that there is a hidden $17.14 and that this money can be put towards the cost of buying the reusable bags and then people can save the rest of it... I sat that I will be spending more than this when I have to buy little bags for my trash cans, to clean out the litterbox, to clean up after a dog, etc. Also where does it end? I have seen more non-bag litter than anything else... are they going to ban pop cans, chip bags, candy bar wrappers, disposable diapers, fast food takeout, beer bottles, or napkins next? It's a slippery slope people, you let the government start making decisions for you like this just wait till they start making bigger decisions and see how happy you are then. If I want to use a reusable bag that should be my decision and mine alone and if I want to use a non-reusable bag it is my decision and mine alone - I do NOT need the government making my decisions for me!
Jim Osburn
12:07 pm on Tuesday, May 31, 2011
What's "non-reusable?" We recycle those plastic bags from the grocery store t line the garbage can. If they are banned, are we supposed to buy plastic liners? Let kitchen refuse slop around and spill on our sanitation workers? Where is the net ecological savings? I wish that our illustratious leaders would think such things through before they ride off on another jihad.
Marilyn Gardner
2:46 pm on Tuesday, May 31, 2011
Hey, I like the idea of banning candy bar wrappers and snack size chip bags. Let people buy reusable containers for those!
Kevin O'Connor
5:09 pm on Tuesday, May 31, 2011
It is always fascinating to see how much interest an issue like the plastic bag ban/tax gets or the Tilted Kilt in Evanston. Both of these issues have received prominent coverage in the Trib, Sun Times and on TV. The most important issue in Evanston, of course, is neither of these issues, but the bankruptcy of Evanston. While politicians and some of their media derriere smoochers focus on this pimple of an issue, the questions to be explored are: How did Evanston end up 225 million dollars short in police and fire pension liabilities, our own City Manager has publicly stated that the COE owes 100 million dollars in capital debt that except for the power of taxation, there is no way to repay that enormous debt: How did that happen?, our City Manager also claims that there is a budget shortfall of between 1.5 to 2 million for the next FY, however, why does the COE continue to spend money through the TIFs and the Economic Development Fund to continue to "privatize profit & socialize risk"? The easy truth is there is no budget shortfall only an unacceptable "status quo" of mispriorities to benefit the few at the expense of the many. Our most important conservation and green issue in Evanston is conservative and frugal use of our tax dollars, our scarcest resource. Without solving that problem and the stark divide of "wealth inequality" in Evanston all other issues are a distant second at best, moot at worst. Oh, to have the focus on the real issues that face all of us.
Clif Brown
9:35 pm on Tuesday, May 31, 2011
This news report on Patch is the best I have seen so far - comprehensive, detailed and loaded with links that can be investigated. If this is made a standard for online reporting in Evanston, we will all be winners.
These bags that we get rid of usually minutes after we use them have very long lifetimes in the wild where they have no purpose. Yes, a small percentage get used again for dog poop or garbage, but watch at the checkout line as a dozen bags are dispensed in one visit to one customer. Bags are put inside of bags, single items get their own bag. I have never ever witnessed a customer say "stop!" It's a perfect example of the profligacy that goes with anything that is "free"
At a telethon I worked, soda pop was free. When the event was over there were almost full soda pop cans everywhere. People would carelessly grab a cold one and not bother to drink it, then grab another. Liquid soda was pouring from trash bins that couldn't be lifted they were so full of pop. If you want to limit the use of something, charge for it.
A conscientious citizenry requires little regulation, but Americans are the undisputed kings of waste. The price of careless behavior is regulation. It's easy to rant about government, but first remember the grade school rule - think before you do so there doesn't have to be a "mom" to come after you. Do you?
Lilly Coleman
2:04 am on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
Lots of trendy bags are available as shopping bags, food and wine packing etc. The purpose of these kind of bags were to get rid of plastic which can cause environmental hazards. Make sure we buy 100% recyclable ones. Check here http://www.discountshoppingbags.com/
Richard Schulte
7:31 am on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
"A conscientious citizenry requires little regulation, but Americans are the undisputed kings of waste. The price of careless behavior is regulation. It's easy to rant about government, but first remember the grade school rule - think before you do so there doesn't have to be a "mom" to come after you. Do you?"
Of course, the above is nonsense. The US is the cleanest nation on Planet Earth from an environmental standpoint. East Germany and the Soviet Union were toxic waste dumps while the communists were in charge. China is busy building coal-fired electric generation plants all over the nation and use coal imported from the US to operate those plants. Our prosperity allows us to act in an eco-friendly manner. Poor nations are not concerned with the environment.
The comment above suggests that government should take the place of our mothers. Do we really want some government bureaucrat taking the place of and acting like our parents?
Clif Brown
11:25 am on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
Richard, you missed the point of the paragraph - we as individuals must act responsibly so that government does not have to act as our mother.
Richard Schulte
11:48 am on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
Clif, what does the term "act responsibly" mean? Is supporting a plastic bag ban while living in an "engergy-guzzling" home and driving a "gas guzzling" car "acting responsibly"? Just walk through Evanston and see all of the "energy guzzling" homes and "gas guzzling" cars. The people who lives in those homes and drive those kind of cars and then support a plastic bag ban are not serious about the environment. They are just trying to feel good about themselves and their lifestyle. If we're serious about the environment, let's go after those big fancy homes and gas-guzzling cars in Evanston and watch what happens then. It'll be better than the 4th of July.
A plastic bag ban is not a serious effort at environmentalism. Let's start pointing our fingers at the real environmental culprits. Once we start doing that, there will be a quite a few less environmentalists.
Simply because you don't support the plastic bag ban, doesn't mean that you don't care about the environment. The problem is the government getting involved and issuing edicts. Who decides what edicts to issue and why are gov't officials so much smarter than those who don't work in government? They aren't smarter than the rest of us. The same can be said about academics. Let common sense be your guide and common sense says keep the gov't out of it.
Clif Brown
1:06 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
Richard - you have the dilemma defined. What is responsible behavior?
What a person considers responsible may not be at all, much of it depends on what his or her peers do and the general attitude of the person. Is Rush Limbaugh taking a cloth bag to the grocery?
Someone who thinks constantly about the environment may consider this bag pricing scheme the most important legislation of the year, I don't.
Nobody likes to be told what to do and nobody likes to pay more than the minimum for anything - free is best of all.
But the costs of what we do are ever more removed from the item or service itself. Global warming is the ultimate example. Even with an active imagination it is almost impossible to connect my driving to the store with a warmer climate in 20 years. Nor can I easily imagine millions doing just as I am doing - but they do. What complexity will not obscure, rationalization will take care of. If one wants to do something, to raise an environmental objection is, for most Americans, not convincing if not laughable, especially if convenience is an issue.
Plastic bags seem like the definition of inconsequential, but there are billions of them cranked out with more and more produced each year. They are commonly seen in the ocean now, remote island beaches are awash with urban litter.
I'd be content with "nobody's gonna tell me what to do" if there was good evidence that the person saying this was voluntarily doing anything on his/her own.
Jim
8:03 am on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
To comrade Brown I would say that the political philosophy in Evanston IS the problem, not the plastic or paper bags. However, the bankruptcy of Evanston and the "bag" issue are related in that the employment of a "sustainability coordinator" is one example of an unnecessary cost in dire economic times and budget deficits. But unless she comes up with ideas which she probably gets from the Journal of Sustainability Administrators, she will lose her job. Will someone please direct me to a location in Evanston where I can see the environmental bag disaster. I have looked on my own but do not seem able to find such a place. The only solution to the notion that all problems can and should be solved by government is to vote them all out of office frequently. If that doesn't work, move out of Evanston and let them grapple with even larger deficits, unless of course the bankrupt state of Illinois bails them out.
Richard Schulte
1:11 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
"Jim, and all anonymous posters, why not identify yourself for all of us?"
Clif, you should know the answer to your question. We live in Crook County, Illinois-the home of the Party. People don't identify themselves out of fear of retribution. It's sad to say, but nonetheless true, that the Democrat machine controls everything here. Step out of line and get knee-capped. One has only to look at some of the statements on Patch. One person on Patch commented that all Republicans were "intolerant" and "haters". What kind of person would say that?
Look at what happened in Madison, Wisconsin with the teacher riot-death threats to legislators who supported Governor Walker and threats against the economic well-being of any Wisconsin resident who doesn't support the teachers' union.
Congresswoman Schakowsky's town hall meeting on Sept. 1, 2009 was attended by SEIU members who attempted to intimidate me after I spoke against the socialist health care proposal.
People who disagree with President Obama's policies being called racist. What kind of country do we live in when all political dissent is dismissed with one word-racist? Is this America? It certainly is not the America that I grew up in.
Don D.
8:16 am on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
Aren't there bigger issues in Evanston to deal with? This is not the first go around, as I recall with respect to bags . There was a bag ordinance enacted when Burger King moved into town - customers have to bag their own food. While not the same, this is the continuation of the same parochial attitude that plagues Evanston.
Please, let's get on to more substantive issues.
Douglas Lober
9:57 am on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
My family of 3 uses nothing but reusable bags for 6 years now. The guy who says ludicrous is actually hilarious!!!
Here is a good info graphic on the plastic bag situation. USA Vs. the World:
check it out!
http://www.reusethisbag.com/reusable-bag-infographics/plastic-bag-bans-world.asp
Thanks!
Doug
Jim
10:14 am on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
By the way (BTW if you are trendy), the use of cloth bags will surely lead to an increase in shoplifting inasmuch as you go in with bags and walk out with bags. The cost of that alone will far outweigh any savings otherwise. But who cares as long as we are environmentally correct.
John C Thomson
10:15 am on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
I don't think I can add to this discussion it seems to be very well covered. I concur with much of what has been said regarding the unnecessary intrusion into the lives of Evanston's citizenry. What I consider to be one of the biggest evils of our country is the EPA, FDA and agencies that restrict our rights by force that we as citizens never voted for. Who are these people and where do they come from, another planet.
Richard Schulte
10:58 am on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
Amen.
Clif Brown
12:18 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
John - how do know about the dead zone in the Gulf of Mexico and others on the West Coast and the contents of the Mississippi that cause it? Government testing of water quality. When the Japanese nuclear reactors were damaged there was fear of radioactivity drifting to this country. The EPA has a grid of monitoring stations that were able to confirm immediately that there was no danger. Was that a "great evil"?
Would you fire all gov't meat inspectors and let companies tell you what is safe meat? Remember the tobacco companies told us about the healthy aspects of smoking. If not for government regulation, you would not be informed of the contents of the packaged food you buy. Jan Schakowsky was the one who drove that law through many years ago.
Do you trust corporations to tell you the truth if it is profitable not to do so? Remember the Ford Pinto? Were seat belts and air bags a result of car company research?
The tap water we drink - another government agency is constantly testing it for quality. Who tests the Great Lakes, the rivers, the output of sewage plants? You didn't elect any of those folks. More evil at work?
A comment was made earlier about American air quality being good - that statement can only be made if of EPA testing proves it to be the case. It has come about as a result of regulations on emissions from cars and industry by Uncle Sam.
There's lots of "shotgun" indignation going around - a Fox news specialty - it needs to be focused.
Richard Schulte
1:22 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
Oh no, not an attack on Fox News now. Is this still America? Next Clif will be calling Sarah Palin stupid. Please stop with the standard liberal lines. Fox News has left CNN in its dust.
Project GreenBag
10:25 am on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
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Richard Schulte
2:03 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
Clif, global warming is a hoax and the plastic washing up on beaches are more than likely from cruise ships, not from grocery stores in Evanston.
With respect to global warming, search on "global cooling" and read all the warnings about global cooling from the mid-1970's. The same people who were telling us about global cooling in the 1970's are telling us about global warming today. I'm old enough to remember the "global cooling" scare in the 1970's.
The "global warming" scare is about research dollars-big $$$$.
Clif Brown
3:48 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
Richard, on anonymity, you don't hide behind it. Why do you excuse those who do? Your reasoning on personal danger from identification reverses the position of victim and assailant show by American history.
Any reading of that history shows that the personal danger in speaking out is almost exclusively to those either on the left or assumed to be sympathetic to the left. See the tumultuous years of organized labor strife and the civil rights movement. Read about the KKK - the nadir of anonymous assault, with "upstanding citizens" donning costumes and masks to injure and kill at will.
Claiming that conservatives are in danger for commenting openly on a blog if they use their real names is laughable, if not insulting to those who were/are truly in danger for their actions - such as the illiterate blacks in the deep South who dared to (try to) register to vote the 1950's, and the Freedom Riders who dared to sit down at a lunch counter reserved for whites only or William L. Moore (google him) a white man shot dead on a highway for simply walking alone with a sign protesting segregation in Alabama. You are turning reality upside down.
In real cases of injury for expression of opinion, those who get hurt are rarely personally known to those who injure them, instead it is one group (often the police) assaulting another at demonstrations that present the greatest danger. See Chicago - 1968. See Kent State.
global cooling? Google it, readers, and consider the sources.
Richard Schulte
5:23 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
Clif, thank you for the opportunity to educate you.
With respect to global cooling, my sources are The New York Times, Time magazine and Newsweek magazine. Use Google and you will find all sorts of information on global cooling dating back to the late 1800's. The scare alternates between global cooling and global warming. I am old enough to have lived through two cycles of the scare.
With respect to violence and intimidation, let's take a look at the Klu Klux Klan. The KKK was a terrorist arm of the Democrat Party. Let's take a look at the intimidation of Jim Crow laws-once again, Democrats. With respect to the trade union movement, there was indeed violence on both sides. However, one of the leaders of the union movement today is Richard Trumpa. Once again, use Google to find out who he is, what he did and his connection to Democrats.
With respect to violence, you can't get anymore violent than today's modern US city. In most large cities in the US, it is Democrats who are in charge. One can only conclude that Democrats condone the violence. Certainly, they don't do anything to prevent it.
With respect to Democrat Convention in Chicago, the protesters and the police clashed. Let's see, the protesters were the left and the Mayor of Chicago was, hmmmm, a Democrat. Funny how Democrats keep popping up in this discussion, isn't it?
Richard Schulte
8:51 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
Clif, just a little more on Jim Crow and Democrats from PBS. All that violence you talk about is Democrat violence.
"The Democratic Party identified itself as the "white man's party" and demonized the Republican Party as being "Negro dominated," even though whites were in control. Determined to re-capture the South, Southern Democrats "redeemed" state after state -- sometimes peacefully, other times by fraud and violence. By 1877, when Reconstruction was officially over, the Democratic Party controlled every Southern state."
http://www.pbs.org/wnet/jimcrow/stories_org_democratic.html
It's amazing what you can learn if you do a little research on history. The history of the Democrat Party is pretty shameful if you ask me. Who are the "intolerant" ones and who are the "haters"? The PBS story on Jim Crow answers that question. Racial segregation is still practiced in our big cities even today. Who controls those cities?-you guessed it. And now you know why black folks are fleeing Chicago and going back to the Republican South. Race relations are far better in the South.
Richard Schulte
7:10 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
Another Ice Age?
Monday, Jun. 24, 1974
Time Magazine
"Man, too, may be somewhat responsible for the cooling trend. The University of Wisconsin's Reid A. Bryson and other climatologists suggest that dust and other particles released into the atmosphere as a result of farming and fuel burning may be blocking more and more sunlight from reaching and heating the surface of the earth."
"Whatever the cause of the cooling trend, its effects could be extremely serious, if not catastrophic. Scientists figure that only a 1% decrease in the amount of sunlight hitting the earth's surface could tip the climatic balance, and cool the planet enough to send it sliding down the road to another ice age within only a few hundred years."
Source: http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,944914-2,00.html
Richard Schulte
7:17 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
The Cooling World
Newsweek, April 28, 1975
"A survey completed last year by Dr. Murray Mitchell of the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration reveals a drop of half a degree in average ground temperatures in the Northern Hemisphere between 1945 and 1968. According to George Kukla of Columbia University, satellite photos indicated a sudden, large increase in Northern Hemisphere snow cover in the winter of 1971-72. And a study released last month by two NOAA scientists notes that the amount of sunshine reaching the ground in the continental U.S. diminished by 1.3% between 1964 and 1972. "
"To the layman, the relatively small changes in temperature and sunshine can be highly misleading. Reid Bryson of the University of Wisconsin points out that the Earth’s average temperature during the great Ice Ages was only about seven degrees lower than during its warmest eras – and that the present decline has taken the planet about a sixth of the way toward the Ice Age average. Others regard the cooling as a reversion to the “little ice age” conditions that brought bitter winters to much of Europe and northern America between 1600 and 1900 – years when the Thames used to freeze so solidly that Londoners roasted oxen on the ice and when iceboats sailed the Hudson River almost as far south as New York City."
http://www.denisdutton.com/cooling_world.htm
Richard Schulte
7:23 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
150 Years of Global Warming and Cooling at the New York Times
CLIMATOLOGY
January 5, 1855, Wednesday
Page 4, 863 words
DISPLAYING FIRST PARAGRAPH - As the climate of every country has an inseparable relation with the physical character of its inhabitants, the attention of the Government was directed, some few years since, to the collection of correct meteorological statistics throughout the whole of the United States.
THIS CLIMATE OF OURS; WHY THESE OPEN WINTERS AND TEMPERATE SUMMERS? THE GEOLOGICAL EVIDENCE OF THE ALTERNATE PREVALENCE OF A SEMITROPICAL ATMOSPHERE.
Climate Perculiarities of New-York.
January 2, 1870, Wednesday
Page 4, 500 words
DISPLAYING FIRST PARAGRAPH - The climate of New-York and the contigu ons Atlantic seaboard has long been a study of great interest. We have just experienced a remarkable instance of its peculiarity The Hudson River, by a singular freak of temperature, has thrown off its icy mantle and opened its waters to navigation.
IS CLIMATE CHANGING?--
March 25, 1888, Wednesday
Page 13, 440 words
DISPLAYING FIRST PARAGRAPH - Formerly wine was made in England, the change of climate might be the principal reason that this manufacture does not now flourish. There are, however, many reasons why British wine ...
IS OUR CLIMATE CHANGING?
February 3, 1889, Wednesday
Page 4, 778 words
Source: http://newsbusters.org/node/11640
Richard Schulte
7:26 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
SCIENTISTS AGREE WORLD IS COLDER; But Climate Experts Meeting Here Fail to Agree on Reasons for Change
January 30, 1961, Monday
By WALTER SULLIVAN
Section: BUSINESS FINANCIAL, Page 46, 1326 words
DISPLAYING FIRST PARAGRAPH - After a week of discussions on the causes of climate change, an assembly of specialists from several continents seems to have reached unanimous agreement on only one point: it is getting colder.
EARTH'S WEATHER GROWING COLDER; U.S. Among the Exceptions, Rome Symposium Hears
October 8, 1961, Sunday
Special to The New York Times.
Page 66, 386 words
DISPLAYING FIRST PARAGRAPH - ROME, Oct. 7 -- The earth, with few regional exceptions, is undergoing "a persistent cold wave" that began in the Nineteen Forties, a United States weather man told a symposium on climate this week.
http://newsbusters.org/node/11640
Richard Schulte
7:33 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
U.S. and Soviet Press Studies of a Colder Arctic; U.S. and Soviet Press Arctic Studies
July 18, 1970, Saturday
By WALTER SULLIVAN
Page 1, 1398 words
DISPLAYING FIRST PARAGRAPH - The United States and the Soviet Union are mounting large-scale investigations to determine why the Arctic climate is becoming more frigid, why parts of the Arctic sea ice have recently become ominously thicker and whether the extent of that ice cover contributes to the onset of ice ages.
Climate Experts Assay Ice Age Clues
January 27, 1972, Thursday
Special to The New York Times
Section: BUSINESS/FINANCE, Page 74, 731 words
Record of a Little Ice Age Is Discovered
February 5, 1972, Saturday
By WALTER SULLIVAN
DISPLAYING FIRST PARAGRAPH - From a study of ice extracted from deep within the Greenland ice sheet it appears that 89,500 years ago something catastrophic changed the climate from being warmer than today's to that of a full-fledged ice age.
Scientist Fears Equable Climate Around World Could Be Ending
October 31, 1972, Tuesday
By BOYCE RENSBERGER
DISPLAYING FIRST PARAGRAPH - The current 12,000-year-old era of comfortable climates around the world may be coming to an end, closing another chapter in what a University of Miami scientist believes has been a history of frequent and relatively short-lived ice ages and warm ages.
Source: http://newsbusters.org/node/11640
Richard Schulte
7:35 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
International Team of Specialists Finds No End in Sight to 30-Year Cooling Trend in Northern Hemisphere
January 5, 1978, Thursday
By WALTER SULLIVAN
Section: Sports, Page D17, 817 words
DISPLAYING FIRST PARAGRAPH - An international team of specialists has concluded from eight indexes of climate that there is no end in sight to the cooling trend of the last 30 years, at least in the Northern Hemisphere.
Climate Specialists, in Poll, Foresee No Catastrophic Weather Changes in Rest of Century; Warning About Carbon Dioxide
February 18, 1978, Saturday
By WALTER SULLIVAN Special to The New York Times
Read more: http://newsbusters.org/node/11640#ixzz1O4fjuhmd
Richard Schulte
7:47 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
Let's see, The New York Times, Time magazine and Newsweek magazine quoting scientists about global warming and global cooling. It appears that the intervals between global warming and global cooling is about 30 to 35 years. If carbon dioxide produced by the burning of fossil fuels causes global warming, how is alternating global warming and global cooling explained?
My educated guess is that the sun is responsible for climate change or perhaps a slight change in the tilt of the earth due to wobble. In both cases, human activity has nothing to do with the sun or the earth's wobble. It would seem that it has nothing to do with carbon dioxide in the atmosphere.
Jim
8:55 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
Clif, I will remain annon and continue to comment if that is ok with you. When I write newsparers and journalists I always give my full name and town but these sites are too uncontrolled to do that here. If you feel you have nothing to lose by disclosing your full name, that is your choice. There are just too many wackos out there for me to take that risk on a site like this one. The fact that you would sieze on that issue suggests to me that you are losing the argument. Cheers!
Jessica Rudis
12:11 am on Thursday, June 2, 2011
Jim, it is actually our policy to require people to comment with their full names. We tend to let it slide, but if it becomes an issue we will start to crack down.
Richard Schulte
6:01 am on Thursday, June 2, 2011
Jessica, given today's political climate, it would be wise not to enforce the requirement that people use their full name. Crook County is well known for its political thugs.
Clif Brown
9:30 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
Richard - your rage and contempt are registered. Please be respectful toward me as I am to you. Sarcasm, "thank you for letting me educate you" isn't needed. Emotion weakens the case for something that needs to be based only on science.
your numerous posts are not necessary for two reasons.
You are making a case that I was not denying. The cooling argument I refer to is the one being made right now. Believe it or not, there are those doing so. If you return to google and do your search again but limit it to the present time (last 3 years or so) and consider the sources you find, you will see what I mean. Those making the claim for cooling are having a hard time of it and the references are decreasing.
Second, to claim that people have been wrong in the past so they are wrong now is a fallacy. You can claim that global warming is a hoax, but you have to back that up with reputable current science to gain adherents. List respected scientific organizations that support your view of a hoax and readers can check them out, including me. For folks interested in the subject, NOAA and NASA have great sites that go into detail about the doubts and why the consensus is growing that global warming is real. Google the three words <NASA global warming> and click the top find of the list. You'll find graphics and data with the scientific support for it referenced in detail. The argument about the sun that you favor is addressed.
Richard Schulte
6:24 am on Thursday, June 2, 2011
Clif, no "rage or contempt" here. Conservatives find liberals amusing because liberals refuse to argue facts. In general, liberals typically resort to name calling. Case in point, you're response above. The reason for the multiple posts is that many adherents to the global warming alarmism have never seen the information because the old media refuses to publish such information.
You cite the NOAA in your post. In the mid-1970's, it was scientists at the NOAA talking about "global cooling". So we have NOAA scientists telling us "global cooling" was occurring 35 years ago and now NOAA scientists are telling us "global warming" is occurring.
Proving that we are in a cooling phase isn't too difficult. If I recall correctly, we had 22 inches of global cooling in Evanston in early February. Britain and northern Europe have had two severe winters.
There are scientists all over the globe who have expressed reservations about the "global warming" hypothesis. The Medival Warm Period followed by the Little Ice Age are indications that "global warming" is flawed. There are records that the Vikings actually grew crops on Greenland during the Medival Warm Period.
Being an engineer and analyzing data for more than 30 years, I am well acquainted with how data can be manipulated, particularly by government. (If you are interested, you may want to read my critique of the collapse of the World Trade Center towers and WTC 7.)
Richard Schulte
9:44 am on Thursday, June 2, 2011
Clif, of course, you are aware that government scientists are political animals. Simply because NASA scientists issue a statement on global warming doesn't make it so. In order to survive, government scientists have to fall in line with the current Administration.
The fact that "scientists" at East Anglia University won't allow other scientists to review their data is a pretty good indication that the global warming data is flawed. Now, those same scientists say that their data has been lost. Good cover-up for a scam.
Clif Brown
9:47 pm on Wednesday, June 1, 2011
Jim - as with Richard - the issue of respect. Please treat others as you'd like to be treated. Of course you are free to remain anonymous, most people do so.
I have been using my full name for some time whenever I comment. I have yet to encounter any adverse consequences of any kind, so I recommend it to all males (not women, because they risk unwanted male attention). If I expect people to take what I say seriously then I have to take responsibility for what I say.
The fact that discourse online is characterized by a very low level of civility is not incidental to anonymity. We know that when people are free from identification, they are capable of just about anything. The ability of people to be anonymous when they drive is one reason for the rudeness, lifted fingers, yelling obscenities that we all encounter when driving.
So full identity puts people on their best behavior, just as it does with face-to-face contact. A simple rule of thumb is write online as though your children would be reading it. My two cents worth.
Richard Schulte
6:35 am on Thursday, June 2, 2011
Clif, the discourse on Evanston Patch is quite civil. Simply because people use facts to dispute opinions is not uncivil. The expression of opinions, without factual basis for those opinions, is what is uncivil. Frankly, I find your characterization of Jim and my comments as uncivil to be both unsubstantiated and uncivil.
I find your attempt to define what is and isn't civil discourse to be distasteful, but I am a believer in the First Amendment rights and will defend your right to be offensive.
John C Thomson
11:29 am on Thursday, June 2, 2011
Hey, what happened to the 'plastic bag issue'? Theres a little of what you Richard, and you Clif have to say about this that and the other but lets stay focused. This occured with the Tilted Kilt issue as well, but after awhile it gets old itself and at that point I check all those Patch email notices and hit delete. On the other hand it was good to see in the paper today that Ben Shapiro has uncovered what most sensible people already knew and that is that the Hollywood/TV Moguls are all leftist liberals that promoted the liberal agenda and now if they could get the news media itself to admit the same and that they are a tool for Obama's political agenda and campaign. Case in point, Obama is making national addresses all over the place anytime day or night. But the big 3 media back in the day deliberately denied Ronald Reagan from making a National Address. Just thought I'd throw in a little more feed for the fodder.
Richard Schulte
12:56 pm on Thursday, June 2, 2011
John, please accept my apologies for all of the posts, however, the foundation for all of this environmental alarmism, such as the plastic bag ban, is "global warming". Global warming is the biggest hoax ever perpetrated on humankind. If Americans come to realize that "global warming" is indeed a hoax, then the environmentalist extremists are discredited. Hence, all of the posts that show that "global warming" is nothing new.
I have no problem with common sense environmentalism and, in fact, encourage it. Your suggestion that the EPA should be disbanded is an excellent idea. It is the EPA who has recently been telling us that carbon dioxide is a pollutant.
It is my opinion that the City of Evanston Sustainability Coordinator should be immediately relieved of her position as a cost saving measure. The Sustainability Coordinator position is a waste of taxpayers funds.
Clif Brown
12:43 pm on Thursday, June 2, 2011
51 comments! John's right, we've gone far off the plastic bag topic.
I like to think of conversations between Evanstonians online in relation to speaking to a neighbor across the fence. So I'll close with something personal, something I think we can all relate to - happiness.
What I love to do is walk in the neighborhood (picking up plastic bags - just to stay on topic) or ride my bike. I'm a fool for any dog I see and just standing outside watching the weather when a storm's coming is fun. I can't resist a freeze at DQ - even though it isn't in Evanston. I enjoy my kids, but they have long been adults and are far away.
How about you, Richard (and Jim if you are still around)
Brian Derstine
1:04 pm on Thursday, June 2, 2011
I think an outright ban would be a bad idea. Prohibitions tend to have bizarre unintended consequences. However, I think D.C. is all the example we need. A 5-cent charge reduces plastic bag use by nearly 80% and raises $2 milllion? That's a no-brainer. Do it.
Reduces our oil consumption, reduces excessive bag use, nudges consumers toward a more environmentally-friendly choice, eliminates unsightly trash in the beautiful city of Evanston, while raising necessary funds. What's not to like?
Yes, we already use reusable bags for all of our shopping. Yes, we have about a dozen reusable bags. No, we don't wash them as much as we should. No, we haven't gotten sick yet. And besides, whatever germs don't kill me simply make me stronger. ;)
Richard Schulte
1:09 pm on Thursday, June 2, 2011
Clif, I'm sorry, but these are serious times. America, as we have known it, is in very grave danger. In 2008, we elected an incompetent as the President of the United States (and in 2010, we elected an incompetent governor). President Obama has led the assault on the US economy and is well on his way toward its destruction. Is it intentional or is it mere incompetence? Many think that it is intentional. I'm on the fence on that subject, but I do have suspicion that it is indeed intentional.
I'm old enough to be concerned about the country that I leave to my son and patriots need to step up and say and do something about it. You may think that things are just fine and, perhaps, they are for you, but when 47 percent of the residents of Detroit are illiterate tells me that the entire system is rotten.
The plastic bag ban is the mere tip of the iceberg.
John C Thomson
2:51 pm on Thursday, June 2, 2011
No apologies needed Richard or Clif just sending out a heads up. I enjoy the dialogues you gentlemen engage in and have learned from you as well. Richard, you should send me an email, mine is jmthomson@sbcglobal.net. I just came across an interesting scandal, google..."Pigford vs. Glickman", one of the biggest non-published scandals in the last 20 years that was covered up.
Clif Brown
3:41 pm on Thursday, June 2, 2011
Richard, there has never been a time when things aren't serious. Everyone needs to be able to find enjoyment in life in one way or another or they can become obsessed, ever more convinced that their own view is the only right one, losing touch with reality.
Take the ultimate bad time - the end of the world, people convinced they alone are in the know. Everything they see in daily life will be further proof of their view, yet it is the same world we all live in and can enjoy. We just saw this with the Judgment Day that came and went a couple of weeks ago. Would the believers have been open to debate? We all carry the world in our heads because that is where it exists - but we have to leave our mental world open at least a crack.
You said "the EPA is evil" in one post. You went on to say NOAA is dedicated to a hoax, has been for over 30 years. NOAA employees are civil service employees, who bring us the daily weather data that makes planning for the day or week possible and who provide the climatological data that agribusiness requires for operation. Get rid of NOAA along with EPA? Far from being a hotbed of conspirators, NOAA employees are likely as bored at work as the working population in general. I'll bet almost all who were there 30 years ago are retired. Where is the conspiracy? They do 9-5 like the rest of us.
You harbor no doubts and speak in absolutes. Again I ask you as my neighbor across the fence, take a break - what makes you smile, what makes you happy?
Richard Schulte
7:32 pm on Thursday, June 2, 2011
Clif, you obviously don't know me. I am one of the most positive and optimistic people on the face of the God's green earth. I have had the pleasure of working for a one man company for 23 years-the boss is a great guy. You haven't lived until you've worked for yourself. That does not preclude me from taking things seriously.
One of my favorite pastimes is listening to Rush Limbaugh, the most positive and optimistic man in America. The man is quite an inspiration. If you listen to his talk show, you will find that Rush's show is much different from a liberal talk show where all you hear is whining and complaining. Rush is actually enjoying himself while he works and you can tell that he loves what he does.
There are people who just live their life without giving a thought to the rest of the world. I am not one of those people. If you can't make a difference, then life is not worth living. I have already made a difference, but I've got plenty of fight left in me. The reason why things are so messed up right now is because way too many people decided to stop caring and stop thinking.
There are absolutes in this world. Everything does not have to be a compromise. And that's why we support people like Sarah Palin and Michele Bachman. You can't imagine how proud I am of Sarah Palin for staying true to her values by bringing a child with Down Syndrome into this world, rather than having an abortion.
Character counts.
Richard Schulte
10:43 am on Sunday, June 5, 2011
". . .I am a scientist who was on the carbon gravy train, understands the evidence, was once an alarmist, but am now a skeptic."
"The whole idea that carbon dioxide is the main cause of the recent global warming is based on a guess that was proved false by empirical evidence during the 1990s. But the gravy train was too big, with too many jobs, industries, trading profits, political careers, and the possibility of world government and total control riding on the outcome. So rather than admit they were wrong, the governments, and their tame climate scientists, now outrageously maintain the fiction that carbon dioxide is a dangerous pollutant."
"Weather balloons had been measuring the atmosphere since the 1960s, many thousands of them every year. The climate models all predict that as the planet warms, a hot spot of moist air will develop over the tropics about 10 kilometres up, as the layer of moist air expands upwards into the cool dry air above. During the warming of the late 1970s, ’80s and ’90s, the weather balloons found no hot spot. None at all. Not even a small one. This evidence proves that the climate models are fundamentally flawed, that they greatly overestimate the temperature increases due to carbon dioxide."
"This evidence first became clear around the mid-1990s."
"At this point, official “climate science” stopped being a science. . . "
Source: http://opinion.financialpost.com/2011/04/07/climate-models-go-cold/
John C Thomson
5:38 pm on Thursday, June 2, 2011
Excuse me Clif, I believe I was the first to call the EPA 'evil'. And I do so for their blocking oil drilling in Alaska. Here are ten reasons we should develop ANWR. http://www.anwr.org/topten.htm
Clif Brown
6:04 pm on Thursday, June 2, 2011
John - you're right, you said it first and Richard gave an amen - my mistake.
Richard Schulte
9:25 am on Friday, June 3, 2011
I went to the Jewel on Chicago Avenue this morning and met a man about 40 years old out front of the store begging for money. I gave him $3 and he asked me if I knew where he could find some work. He told me he hadn't slept in 3 days and after begging in front of Jewel, he was headed for the EPL, probably to freshen up and get some sleep. He told me that he didn't want to be standing around begging and all he wanted to do was work. He said begging robbed him of his self-respect. I told him about my 5 weeks on food stamps a year ago and told him that showing a Link Card at the store robbed me of my self-respect. After 5 weeks, I told the State of Illinois to take their food stamps and shove it. Self-respect is more important than food.
The employment statistics for May just came out this morning and things look bad for my new friend and me too. Kind of puts the plastic bag ban in perspective.
Incidentally, the man in front of the Jewel happened to be black folk. The unemployment rate for black folks is around 16 percent. If you're white folk and think its bad, imagine how black folks feel. We know how to fix the economy-President Kennedy did it and so did President Reagan.
In the immortal words of James Carville, "It's the economy stupid." Tax cuts worked for the economy under Kennedy and Reagan. Tax cuts will also work for my friend begging out front of Jewel. He doesn't want a hand-out, he wants a hand up. Banning plastic bags is insanity.
Jim Osburn
10:35 pm on Friday, June 3, 2011
OK, time to grab thisRichard Schulte and put him in office! At first he will politely decline, becuase he knows that public service is filled with hypocrites, scam artists, egotists and incompetents, but we really need people who have great ideas and the ability learn from the past and express their views with passion and compassion.
Any takers? Any one willing to join and change the world? Let's get together.
Jim Osburn
Richard Schulte
8:51 am on Saturday, June 4, 2011
Mr. Osburn, the only way I know how to reply is with a few quotes from Marx and one quote from Abraham Lincoln:
"A black cat crossing your path signifies that the animal is going somewhere."
"A child of five would understand this. Send someone to fetch a child of five."
"Before I speak, I have something important to say."
"I didn't like the play, but then I saw it under adverse conditions - the curtain was up."
And the Groucho Marx quote most applicable to me:
"I don't care to belong to a club that accepts people like me as members."
Abraham Lincoln:
"America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.'
Lincoln was correct and that's what's happening now-President Obama and his minions (including the Evanston plastic bag banners) are trying to destroy this country, but fortunately America is fighting back. I have faith that patriotic Americans will prevail over President Obama.
I voted for Jimmy Carter in 1976, so I understand how Americans could have voted for Obama. (I was young and dumb once upon a time too. ) The Republican candidate in 2008 wasn't much better and I refused to vote for McCain. To his credit, at least John McCain brought Sarah Palin to the national stage.
Character counts.
Richard Schulte
7:58 pm on Saturday, June 4, 2011
"Nothing frustrates me more than GOP candidates walking on eggs, cautious not to offend or anger the despicable, lying, agenda-driven and evil liberal media. Why should we show respect for characterless people who are committed to lying and putting a negative spin on everything we say and do? The liberal media's mission is to politically "kill" the tea party."
"Patriots, we need a fearless political gunslinging hero. And so far, our heroic pistol packin' mama is Sarah Palin."
Lloyd Marcus, Proud Unhyphenated American
Mr. Osburn, there are many of us who have had enough of Democrat-controlled Crook County and kook-controlled Evanston. Mayor Daley has run the City of Chicago into the ground and then abandoned the sinking ship. As Chicago goes, so goes Evanston. I am not the only one who thinks that Chicago will look like Detroit does today in about 20 years.
On Memorial Day, North Avenue Beach was closed out of fear of gang violence. The July 4th fireworks display was cancelled in Chicago out of fear of gang violence. And what's Evanston doing about violence in this fair city? Proposing a ban on plastic shopping bags. We all know criminal gangs would never frequent a city if they had to bring their own reusable shopping bags. Plastic bags are perfect for hiding guns. No plastic shopping bags, no guns. Brilliant. Why didn't we think of that before?
Arif Rabby
1:55 pm on Wednesday, March 21, 2012
Here is a collection of eco bags... www.jutecolab.com